Pete66

Hi All,

Can anyone out there reason this one, Last year I applied for and got
my Police certificate in the UK it came back 100% clean, Being mindful
of the 12 month life of the certificates I applied this year with a
duplicate copy of last years form and it came back with 15 and 22 year
old convictions on it, Nothing serious 3 juvinile theft and 1 adult
pulic order. Although the information is correct, I am somewhat miffed
that last year it was obvious that the NIS had followed the ACPO
guidelines and deleted the convictions after 10 or 20 years for these
type of convictions, but this year they have not.
I spoke to my local Police data protection officer who said that they
should not still be on the record/certificate so I have written to the
NIS asking for them to remove them. I need this certificate for my
emloyment and even though these convictions are spent by terms of the
rehabilitaion of offenders act and I dont work in a job with at risk
people it is highly distressing that I now must probably leave my job
because I am unable to show a clear certificate.
I am aware that I must disclose for visa's etc but I am just miffed.
Has anyone else had this? What did you do? What can I do?

Anyone know any good lawyers in this field.

Thanks for any feedback

Metch

Hi

I have the same question, I have convictions spent under the
rehabiitation of offenders act, but am unsure if I need to declare them,
I am afforded protection under the Data Protection Act as normaly this
info is not supplied on request unless an advanced disclosure is signed.



However after 9/11, chances are they will have some protocl in place.



But studying the sites, it looks as though the USA have a statutory
limit attached to offences which expires after 5 years. Dont quote me
but if they are spent you are of good moral standing in the eyes of the
UK, and it would seem the US, so declaring them may be foolhardy if you
are rehabilitated.



I am looking at options for myself, and am interested to know if you
need a police certificate for a M-1 Visa?

Pollyana

Hi Pete,



A partial possible explanation for you.

Once offences are weeded under ACPO guidelines they are removed forever
from the Police National Computer. Without my book in front of me i
can't say for sure, but they sound like they should be spent, and as you
have written to NIS they ought to remove them. You can then request
another check, and it should come back clean.

If your police check was clear last year, but not this year, there is a
reasonable chance that human error was involved. The police checks are
done by typing your details into a computer which suggests possible
matches. It sounds awful, but its true that if the checker makes a
typing error, or doesn't read the screen properly to pick out the match,
then a mistake can be made on the result issued.



So to anyone who gets something back that they are not expecting - do
query it, unfortunately humans do make mistakes.



Pollyana (former vetting clerk)

Ingo Pakleppa - See Web Site For Email

In addition to what the others told you, note that for US immigration
purposes, it doesn't matter that these convictions were "spent" or
"expunged" or whatever else. You would still have to disclose them to US
immigration authorities.

On Sun, 18 Jan 2004 05:02:06 -0800, Pete66 wrote:

    > Hi All,
    >
    > Can anyone out there reason this one, Last year I applied for and got my
    > Police certificate in the UK it came back 100% clean, Being mindful of
    > the 12 month life of the certificates I applied this year with a
    > duplicate copy of last years form and it came back with 15 and 22 year
    > old convictions on it, Nothing serious 3 juvinile theft and 1 adult
    > pulic order. Although the information is correct, I am somewhat miffed
    > that last year it was obvious that the NIS had followed the ACPO
    > guidelines and deleted the convictions after 10 or 20 years for these
    > type of convictions, but this year they have not. I spoke to my local
    > Police data protection officer who said that they should not still be on
    > the record/certificate so I have written to the NIS asking for them to
    > remove them. I need this certificate for my emloyment and even though
    > these convictions are spent by terms of the rehabilitaion of offenders
    > act and I dont work in a job with at risk people it is highly
    > distressing that I now must probably leave my job because I am unable to
    > show a clear certificate. I am aware that I must disclose for visa's etc
    > but I am just miffed. Has anyone else had this? What did you do? What
    > can I do?
    >
    > Anyone know any good lawyers in this field.
    >
    > Thanks for any feedback

Pedro66

Hi Thanks for the input, I went to see a Immigration Lawyer in London
today and found that in his opinion I have nothing to worry about with
my past history.

His explanation is as follows...

My Juvenile convictions before the age of 18 are not counted against
my application, and are not grounds for exclusion but must be
declared.

My Adult conviction is for a crime in the Lawyers view not a CIMT and
again would not be grounds for refusal of a PR Visa.

When I asked about my use of VW Scheme I was told that I should of
declared the convictions. But as they were not grounds for refusal the
fact I had not declared them would of been frowned upon but not be
held against me, it seems that it is only bad when you dont disclose
somthing that would cause you not to get a visa.

So for me it is good news, I am not a lawyer so if your in the same
position as me get aalong to see one.

Ingo Pakleppa - see web site for email <> wrote in message news:<>...
    > In addition to what the others told you, note that for US immigration
    > purposes, it doesn't matter that these convictions were "spent" or
    > "expunged" or whatever else. You would still have to disclose them to US
    > immigration authorities.
    >
    > On Sun, 18 Jan 2004 05:02:06 -0800, Pete66 wrote:
    >
    > > Hi All,
    > >
    > > Can anyone out there reason this one, Last year I applied for and got my
    > > Police certificate in the UK it came back 100% clean, Being mindful of
    > > the 12 month life of the certificates I applied this year with a
    > > duplicate copy of last years form and it came back with 15 and 22 year
    > > old convictions on it, Nothing serious 3 juvinile theft and 1 adult
    > > pulic order. Although the information is correct, I am somewhat miffed
    > > that last year it was obvious that the NIS had followed the ACPO
    > > guidelines and deleted the convictions after 10 or 20 years for these
    > > type of convictions, but this year they have not. I spoke to my local
    > > Police data protection officer who said that they should not still be on
    > > the record/certificate so I have written to the NIS asking for them to
    > > remove them. I need this certificate for my emloyment and even though
    > > these convictions are spent by terms of the rehabilitaion of offenders
    > > act and I dont work in a job with at risk people it is highly
    > > distressing that I now must probably leave my job because I am unable to
    > > show a clear certificate. I am aware that I must disclose for visa's etc
    > > but I am just miffed. Has anyone else had this? What did you do? What
    > > can I do?
    > >
    > > Anyone know any good lawyers in this field.
    > >
    > > Thanks for any feedback
    >
    > --
    > Remember, I am strictly a layperson without any legal training. I encourage
    > everybody to seek competent legal counsel rather than relying on usenet
    > newsgroups.
    >
    > Please support H.R. 539, H.R. 832 and S. 1510. More information at
    > http://www.kkeane.com/lobbyspousal-faq.shtml
    >
    > Please visit my new FAQ at http://www.kkeane.com (always under construction)
    >
    > My email address in usenet posts is now invalid for spam protection. See
    > my Web site for information on how to contact me.
    >
    > Please feel free to enjoy some of my photographs at my Web site
    > http://www.ingopakleppa.com ! Comments are welcome.

Metch

The following is a copy of an email I recieved today in respect of
criminal convictions and removale.

The Police National Computer (PNC)
only holds details of ´Recordable´ offences e.g. those offences for
which a prison sentence could be given. For example, most driving
offences are not recorded on the PNC.

To comply with the Data
Protection Act, the Association of Chief Police Officers (ACPO) have set
out guidelines for police forces to remove certain offences that took
place more than 10 years ago and the person has not been convicted of
another offence since that time. The same applies to cautions but the
period used is 5 years. There are some exceptions to these guidelines.


The following provides a general overview -

Convictions are removed
from the PNC under ACPO guidelines unless the police can show that the
offender has:

three or more convictions for recordable offences. In
which case the record will be kept for 20 years

been give a custodial
sentence, including suspended sentences, amounting to six months or
more, in which case the record will be kept for life

been convicted of
indecency; sexual offences; violence offences; possession of class A
drugs; or trafficking in, importation of, or supply of any drug, in
which case the record will be kept for life

been found unfit to plead
for reason of insanity, or has been sentenced under the Mental Health
Act, in which case the record will be kept for life

been convicted of
an offence involving a child or vulnerable adult where their modus
operandi indicates that the person deliberately targets such people, in
which case the record will be kept for life.

There is information on
criminal record weeding on the ACPO website
www.acpo.police.uk in the Policies section under the heading
Data Protection - Code of Practice or you may wish to contact ACPO on
020 7227 3434 or email them on . If
you would like to find out what information is held about you on the
Police National Computer then you should make a subject access request
to your local police force. You should be aware that some exemptions may
apply.

Please do not hesitate to contact us if we can be of any
further assistance.