Jenney & Mark

Mark & I went to the DMV today to see about getting him a learners
permit. After 30 days of having this permit, he can then apply for a
Virginia drivers license. We'd printed out the list of acceptable
documents and bought everything Mark had to meet those requirements.
(You can see this list at
http://www.dmv.state.va.us/webdoc/pdf/dmv141.pdf)


Unfortunately we discovered that something we *thought* would be
accepted as proof of his legal presence (a new requirement, by the way)
actually was not. On the list of documents you can use to prove legal
presence was "Valid Foreign Passport with (K1, K2, K3, K4) visa and I-
94."

What threw us off was the absence of the word "unexpired." Unlike
most other items on that same list, it did NOT say his passport, visa,
and I-94 all had to be "unexpired." As far as we were concerned, Mark's
passport IS valid, and DOES have a visa and I-94. The passport has not
expired, but the visa and I-94 have. So even though he *technically* met
the requirement -- as described on the list -- his application was
rejected because those two things were expired.

To his credit, after
relaying this news, the DMV guy was very sympathetic. He even said,
"It's so hard in cases like this, because the immigration process can
take such a long time." That made me feel a little bit better, at least.


So we then reviewed the list with the DMV guy, so we were sure what
else Mark could bring to meet this requirement. The only thing that
he'll have soon that qualifies is the "Unexpired Employment
Authorization Card." Luckily we're going to Norfolk next Friday to pick
this up.

We were concerned, though, because right next to that it says
in parentheses, "(I-688A/I-688B, I-766)" -- NOT I-765. When we voiced
our concern, the DMV guy said not to worry, that as long as it's an
official EAD, that's all that matters.

(I looked up I-688A, I-688B &
I-766 later and discovered these have something to do with Haitian &
Nicaraguan nationals. Hmm.)

I think I'm going to send some feedback to
the Virginia DMV and asking them to rephrase those two requirements.
First, to say, "Valid and unexpired Foreign Passport, with an unexpired
(K1, K2, K3, K4) visa and unexpired I-94." And second, to include I-765
as one of the Employment Authorization Cards they'll accept. Don't know
if they'll listen, but it's worth a try, right?

So after Mark gets
his EAD next week (!) we'll try this again. Fingers crossed...

~ Jenney

Johncindy

Originally posted by Jenney & Mark
    >
    >
    > So after Mark
gets his EAD next week (!) we'll try this again. Fingers crossed...

    > ~ Jenney

Good luck Jenney and Mark. John needed his EAD
in NJ before obtaining his driver's lic.

Now he drives more than I
do.

Cindy

Andy Platt

"Jenney & Mark" <member2595@british_expats.com> wrote:

    > We were concerned, though, because right next to that it says
    > in parentheses, "(I-688A/I-688B, I-766)" -- NOT I-765. When we voiced
    > our concern, the DMV guy said not to worry, that as long as it's an
    > official EAD, that's all that matters.

The I-765 is the form you use to apply for the EAD; the I-688B is the card
you get. So it will be fine.

I'm actually quite impressed that the recent VA changes were well thought
through. A lot of other states had kneejerk reactions that prevented pending
AOSers from getting driver's licenses at all. Of course it would be nice if
they mentioned the I-94 needed to still be valid - they used to when I got
my VA license. BTW, it *would* be an error if they required the visa to
still be valid because obviously the visa can be expired but the I-94 still
valid.

    > I think I'm going to send some feedback to
    > the Virginia DMV and asking them to rephrase those two requirements.
    > First, to say, "Valid and unexpired Foreign Passport, with an unexpired
    > (K1, K2, K3, K4) visa and unexpired I-94." And second, to include I-765
    > as one of the Employment Authorization Cards they'll accept. Don't know
    > if they'll listen, but it's worth a try, right?

Obviously you don't want to mention the I-765! But you might want to mention
that a visa can be expired but the status is still valid.

Andy.

Jenney & Mark

Originally posted by Andy Platt
    > The I-765 is the form
you use to apply for the EAD; the I-688B is the card you get. So it will
be fine.

Ok - that makes more sense. Not ever having seen an
EAD, I didn't realize the number isn't the same as the form. Thanks for
that clarification.

    > Of course it would be nice if they
mentioned the I-94 needed to still be valid - they used to when I got my
VA license. BTW, it *would* be an error if they required the visa to
still be valid because obviously the visa can be expired but the I 94
still valid.
    >
    > Aah, but that was where the confusion stepped
in - it *only* said "valid," not "unexpired" - and ALL THREE things
(passport, visa & I-94) have to be unexpired AND valid in order to
qualify. At least according to the DMV guy.
    >
    > ~ Jenney

Andy Platt

"Jenney & Mark" <member2595@british_expats.com> wrote:

    > > Of course it would be nice if they
    > mentioned the I-94 needed to still be valid - they used to when I got my
    > VA license. BTW, it *would* be an error if they required the visa to
    > still be valid because obviously the visa can be expired but the I 94
    > still valid.
    > >
    > > Aah, but that was where the confusion stepped
    > in - it *only* said "valid," not "unexpired" - and ALL THREE things
    > (passport, visa & I-94) have to be unexpired AND valid in order to
    > qualify. At least according to the DMV guy.

There's a disconnect somewhere. Here's what the DMV site says:

"Unexpired foreign passport with an expired or unexpired visa, I-94 or I-94W
or I-551 stamp. An I-94W MUST be from a country participating in the Visa
Waiver Pilot Program."

That's a little poor because it doesn't say that the I-94, I-94W or I-551
stamp have to be unexpired which they obviously must be. However it does
state the visa can be unexpired which, as I said, is correct.

Andy.

Andy Platt

"Andy Platt" <> wrote:

    > There's a disconnect somewhere. Here's what the DMV site says:

Whoops, I see that's not in the legal presence section which certainly
doesn't say anything about the expiration of those!

As you were!

Andy.

Girlyflyer

Originally posted by Jenney & Mark
    > Mark & I went to the
DMV today to see about getting him a learners permit. After 30 days of
having this permit, he can then apply for a Virginia drivers license.
We'd printed out the list of acceptable documents and bought everything
Mark had to meet those requirements. (You can see this list at
http://www.dmv.state.va.us/webdoc/pdf/dmv141.pdf)
    >
Unfortunately we discovered that something we *thought* would be
accepted as proof of his legal presence (a new requirement, by the way)
actually was not. On the list of documents you can use to prove legal
presence was "Valid Foreign Passport with (K1, K2, K3, K4) visa and I-
94."
    >
    > What threw us off was the absence of the word "unexpired."
Unlike most other items on that same list, it did NOT say his passport,
visa, and I-94 all had to be "unexpired." As far as we were concerned,
Mark's passport IS valid, and DOES have a visa and I-94. The passport
has not expired, but the visa and I-94 have. So even though he
*technically* met the requirement -- as described on the list -- his
application was rejected because those two things were expired.
    >
    > To
his credit, after relaying this news, the DMV guy was very sympathetic.
He even said, "It's so hard in cases like this, because the immigration
process can take such a long time." That made me feel a little bit
better, at least.
    >
    > So we then reviewed the list with the DMV guy, so
we were sure what else Mark could bring to meet this requirement. The
only thing that he'll have soon that qualifies is the "Unexpired
Employment Authorization Card." Luckily we're going to Norfolk next
Friday to pick this up.
    >
    > We were concerned, though, because right
next to that it says in parentheses, "(I-688A/I-688B, I-766)" -- NOT I-
765. When we voiced our concern, the DMV guy said not to worry, that as
long as it's an official EAD, that's all that matters.
    >
    > (I looked up
I-688A, I-688B & I-766 later and discovered these have something to do
with Haitian & Nicaraguan nationals. Hmm.)
    >
    > I think I'm going to
send some feedback to the Virginia DMV and asking them to rephrase those
two requirements. First, to say, "Valid and unexpired Foreign Passport,
with an unexpired (K1, K2, K3, K4) visa and unexpired I-94." And second,
to include I-765 as one of the Employment Authorization Cards they'll
accept. Don't know if they'll listen, but it's worth a try, right? :)

    > So after Mark gets his EAD next week (!) we'll try this again.
Fingers crossed...
    >
    > ~ Jenney

I wish I would have seen
this before my David spent all morning in the DMV, again. I, too, wish
they would be more clear with their wording. The first time we went in
with our marriage liscense (exactly what they ask for) and were told
they "meant" marriage certificate. Well if you "mean" that why don't you
"say" that. This time, we brought in the I-94 (now expired) and they
"meant" for it to say "unexpired". So now the story is that a I-797
would suffice.

Our NOA from the I-129F approval was a I-797 (which
ironically expired Jan 27th) Don't we get an NOA for the filing of
EAD/AOS?... If we don't get an NOA for the AOS/EAD, do we have to wait
until the EAD is issued? (Which for us seems to be at least 4 months
away - Arlington office) Any other Virginia DMV suggestions?

Jenney & Mark

Went back to the DMV today, and..... SUCCESS!!! :)

Mark now has his
learners permit!! :) (heehee, I can't say that without laughing, given
that he just turned 32 on Saturday!)

This time we went back armed with
his new EAD card, along with everything else we'd brought before: his
passport (with K1 visa and I-94), a recent utility bill in his name and
our address, a copy of our marriage license, and his SS card. Having the
EAD did the trick this time.

It took about 10 minutes for the lady to
fill out all the forms (she said there were new codes they had to use,
and she wanted to make sure she was using the correct ones), then he had
to take his eye exam. After that, she handed Mark back his application
(with some additional info written on it by her) and he was instructed
to go to where the multiple choice exam was given.

Mark said the exam
was only 35 questions, and he only missed one -- yay, Mark! :)

After
that, we waited a few minutes before he was called up to get his photo
taken. The card he got back looks exactly like a VA drivers license,
except it says "DL Learners Permit." It's been so long since I had my
learners permit, but I'm pretty sure it didn't look anything like my
license; I don't even think it had a photo. But just glancing at Mark's,
you'd swear it was a regular license.

The DMV lady gave his permit an
expiration that matched the expiration of his EAD card, Feb 17, 2005.
However, he can take his road skills test after holding the permit for
30 days, which is what we plan to do. That way, once he has his license
Mark can legally drive alone without needing me in the car as his
chaperone (*snicker!*).

So this is just one more thing ticked off the
list of "things to do." It feels really good to finally feel we're
moving forward, what with getting the EAD last week and his permit this
week. Now all we need to do is get him a job! :)

~ Jenney

Girlyflyer

Originally posted by Jenney & Mark
    > Went back to the DMV
today, and..... SUCCESS!!! :)
    >
    > Mark now has his learners permit!! :)
(heehee, I can't say that without laughing, given that he just turned 32
on Saturday!)
    >
    > This time we went back armed with his new EAD card,
along with everything else we'd brought before: his passport (with K1
visa and I-94), a recent utility bill in his name and our address, a
copy of our marriage license, and his SS card. Having the EAD did the
trick this time.
    >
    > It took about 10 minutes for the lady to fill out
all the forms (she said there were new codes they had to use, and she
wanted to make sure she was using the correct ones), then he had to take
his eye exam. After that, she handed Mark back his application (with
some additional info written on it by her) and he was instructed to go
to where the multiple choice exam was given.
    >
    > Mark said the exam was
only 35 questions, and he only missed one -- yay, Mark! :)
    >
    > After
that, we waited a few minutes before he was called up to get his photo
taken. The card he got back looks exactly like a VA drivers license,
except it says "DL Learners Permit." It's been so long since I had my
learners permit, but I'm pretty sure it didn't look anything like my
license; I don't even think it had a photo. But just glancing at Mark's,
you'd swear it was a regular license.
    >
    > The DMV lady gave his permit
an expiration that matched the expiration of his EAD card, Feb 17, 2005.
However, he can take his road skills test after holding the permit for
30 days, which is what we plan to do. That way, once he has his license
Mark can legally drive alone without needing me in the car as his
chaperone (*snicker!*).
    >
    > So this is just one more thing ticked off
the list of "things to do." It feels really good to finally feel we're
moving forward, what with getting the EAD last week and his permit this
week. Now all we need to do is get him a job! :)
    >
    > ~ Jenney


Nice to start the morning off with a DMV success story, although David
has appropriately renamed it the DMFS.... (oh dear!) We're in the same
boat and waiting for Arlington to issue the EAD. If I might pass on some
experience to other Virginia K-1ers, here's what we would have done
differently.

We would have gone to the DMFs after we were married with
this in hand:

Passport w/ Visa
Utility Bill (
SS Card
Mariage
Certificate (Remember they ask for a Marriage Liscense, which is what is
it before you are married, but they really mean a marriage certificate.)

and the I-797, which is the NOA2

Now had we taken all of these things
in after we were married, but before the NOA2's expiry date, we would
have been able to get his Permit.

Now this might not seem like that big
of a deal, however, Virginia is a state, at least with my Insurance
that does not allow you to have an uninsured driver in the house. So,
when I called to change my name with them, they asked for my husband's
details. The difference in cost to add him went from $50 with a state
drivers liscense to $250 with his International for the 6 month Premium.


I don't understand all the ins and out of the Insurance world. And I
really don't understand the ins and outs of the DMFs world, because it
changes on a whim, but hopefully our little experience can help someone
down the road.