What Ever

My wife and I are planning to travel to Europe as tourists from USA
between Nov. 20th and Nov. 28th. I need help in planning the trip.

Here are the places we are interested in. We are primarily interested
in site seeing.

1. Paris: I am assuming one night and two days would be sufficient. We
are interested in visiting Eiffel Tower, Louvre, and Seine. I am not
sure what else we can see in 2 days.

2. Switzerland: Zurich, and Alps (I am not sure what city we should
visit for Alps, and if November would be a good time). We are planning
to stay for 1 night and 2 days.

3. Italy: We like to visit Rome, Vatican City, Venice. I am assuming 4
days and 4 nights would be sufficient.

Here are the things that I need help with. I greatly appreciate your
feedback.

1. Travel: Is there a travel agent that you could recommend to get a
better trans Atlantic flight rates. We will be leaving from
Baltimore/Washington D.C. area and would like to reach Paris, and then
probably return from one of the Italian cities.

2. Travel from one country to another within Europe (and from one city
to another): Is it advisable to purchase rail tickets instead of rail
passes? Where can I find information on how long it takes and how much
it costs?

3. Itinerary feasibility: Do you think this itinerary is feasible? Or
should I make any changes? I have a total of 10 days including
trans-Atlantic flying time.

4. Places to stay: Do you have any recommendations on where we could
stay. We are planning to spend around $100/night.

5. Recommendations on "places to Visit": We are first time travelers,
we believe we like scenic mountains in Switzerland, Lakes in Italy,
over-all architectural beauty of Europe, and everything about Paris.
Are there any particular recommendations you would like to make?

6. Food: Both my wife and I are vegetarians; we hope finding
vegetarian food wouldn't be a problem. Milk products are okay.

7. Language: We both speak English, do we need to learn native
language of the country or can we manage with English?

Anything else that I am missing?

Thanks a lot in advance.

SP.

A.Spencer3

"What Ever" <> wrote in message
news:...
    > My wife and I are planning to travel to Europe as tourists from USA
    > between Nov. 20th and Nov. 28th. I need help in planning the trip.
    > Here are the places we are interested in. We are primarily interested
    > in site seeing.
    > 1. Paris: I am assuming one night and two days would be sufficient. We
    > are interested in visiting Eiffel Tower, Louvre, and Seine. I am not
    > sure what else we can see in 2 days.
    > 2. Switzerland: Zurich, and Alps (I am not sure what city we should
    > visit for Alps, and if November would be a good time). We are planning
    > to stay for 1 night and 2 days.
    > 3. Italy: We like to visit Rome, Vatican City, Venice. I am assuming 4
    > days and 4 nights would be sufficient.
Gulp!

How about forgetting Paris, basing in Venice, visiting Rome and the
Dolomites or Italian Alps (and maybe the Lakes, Florence, etc.).

Otherwise, with travelling, you'll only have about a day for each
sightseeing trip.

Surreyman

nitram

On Wed, 15 Sep 2004 15:26:19 GMT, "a.spencer3"
<> wrote:

    >"What Ever" <> wrote in message
    >news:...
    >> My wife and I are planning to travel to Europe as tourists from USA
    >> between Nov. 20th and Nov. 28th. I need help in planning the trip.
    >> Here are the places we are interested in. We are primarily interested
    >> in site seeing.
    >> 1. Paris: I am assuming one night and two days would be sufficient. We
    >> are interested in visiting Eiffel Tower, Louvre, and Seine. I am not
    >> sure what else we can see in 2 days.
    >> 2. Switzerland: Zurich, and Alps (I am not sure what city we should
    >> visit for Alps, and if November would be a good time). We are planning
    >> to stay for 1 night and 2 days.
    >> 3. Italy: We like to visit Rome, Vatican City, Venice. I am assuming 4
    >> days and 4 nights would be sufficient.
    >Gulp!
    >How about forgetting Paris, basing in Venice,

in the November fog?

    > visiting Rome and the
    >Dolomites or Italian Alps (and maybe the Lakes, Florence, etc.).
    >Otherwise, with travelling, you'll only have about a day for each
    >sightseeing trip.

Miguel Cruz

What Ever <> wrote:
    > My wife and I are planning to travel to Europe as tourists from USA
    > between Nov. 20th and Nov. 28th. I need help in planning the trip.
    > 1. Paris: I am assuming one night and two days would be sufficient.

I'm not sure you'll get a lot of agreement on that. I don't particularly
like Paris and I would say two weeks is the bare minimum.

    > We are interested in visiting Eiffel Tower, Louvre, and Seine. I am not
    > sure what else we can see in 2 days.

Probably not much, especially if you approach the Louvre with any
seriousness.

    > 2. Switzerland: Zurich, and Alps (I am not sure what city we should
    > visit for Alps, and if November would be a good time). We are planning
    > to stay for 1 night and 2 days.

Both of these days will be partial travel days. That makes it pretty hard to
relax on either of them.

    > 3. Italy: We like to visit Rome, Vatican City, Venice. I am assuming 4
    > days and 4 nights would be sufficient.
    > Here are the things that I need help with. I greatly appreciate your
    > feedback.
    > 1. Travel: Is there a travel agent that you could recommend to get a
    > better trans Atlantic flight rates. We will be leaving from
    > Baltimore/Washington D.C. area and would like to reach Paris, and then
    > probably return from one of the Italian cities.

That's a pretty generic flight. I would guess you could do just as well with
Orbitz as with a travel agency. Orbitz has an option that lets you choose
multi-city trips which is how you'd do the "open jaw" (flying into one city
and out of another). The fare should work out to the average of round-trips
to either city (e.g., if a round-trip to Paris is $400 and a round-trip to
Rome is $500, then the open jaw will ideally cost around $450).

    > 3. Itinerary feasibility: Do you think this itinerary is feasible? Or
    > should I make any changes? I have a total of 10 days including
    > trans-Atlantic flying time.

It's up to you of course but I think you are setting yourself up for an
exhausting and not particularly fulfilling experience as you spend a
considerable proportion of your time dealing with travel logistics.

    > 6. Food: Both my wife and I are vegetarians; we hope finding
    > vegetarian food wouldn't be a problem. Milk products are okay.

You'll manage.

    > 7. Language: We both speak English, do we need to learn native
    > language of the country or can we manage with English?

If you can learn French, German, and Italian by November 20, you're a better
man than I. I think you're stuck with English. It won't be much of a problem
since you're going to be in big cities (and Switzerland, where English is
pretty widely understood). It would be an excellent idea to learn some of
the most basic stuff (hello, goodbye, please, thank you, do you speak
English, and the numbers).

miguel

barney

In article <>,
(What Ever) wrote:

    > My wife and I are planning to travel to Europe as tourists from USA
    > between Nov. 20th and Nov. 28th. I need help in planning the trip.
    >
    > Here are the places we are interested in. We are primarily interested
    > in site seeing.
    >
    > 1. Paris: I am assuming one night and two days would be sufficient. We
    > are interested in visiting Eiffel Tower, Louvre, and Seine. I am not
    > sure what else we can see in 2 days.

Not much. You could certainly see the Eiffel Tower and the Louvre in a day
and take one of the evening cruises on the Seine, which are quite
interesting (though I imagine they're pretty chilly in late November).
On the other day you could see a couple of other major sights, maybe
Notre Dame and Sacre Coeur/Montmartre.

But this is just scraping the obvious touristic surface of the city.

There's a general opinion in this group that it's not worth staying
anywhere for one night (except to break a journey, of course) because so
much of the two days surrounding is taken up finding the hotel/checking
in/getting your bearings/checking out the next day and so on. There can
also be a problem with having to carry luggage around.

    > 2. Switzerland: Zurich, and Alps (I am not sure what city we should
    > visit for Alps, and if November would be a good time). We are planning
    > to stay for 1 night and 2 days.

With your limited time I would skip Switzerland - but see below.

    > 3. Italy: We like to visit Rome, Vatican City, Venice. I am assuming 4
    > days and 4 nights would be sufficient.

In this time you could have a good stab at seeing either Rome OR Venice.
IMHO although Venice has its loyal fans, there's more to do and see in
Rome and it's also more "typically Italian", if that matters to you.

The Vatican City is in Rome.

    > 2. Travel from one country to another within Europe (and from one city
    > to another): Is it advisable to purchase rail tickets instead of rail
    > passes? Where can I find information on how long it takes and how much
    > it costs?

    > 3. Itinerary feasibility: Do you think this itinerary is feasible? Or
    > should I make any changes? I have a total of 10 days including
    > trans-Atlantic flying time.

It's very ambitious and won't leave you much time for enjoying yourself. I
would suggest you consider something like:

DAY 1 USA->Paris
DAY 2 in Paris
DAY 3 in Paris
DAY 4 in Paris
DAY 5 Paris -> Rome
DAY 6 in Rome
DAY 7 in Rome
DAY 8 in Rome
DAY 9 in Rome
DAY 10 Rome->USA

Of course you could give Paris an extra day and Rome a day less.

With your timescale I think you maybe ought to fly from Paris to Rome,
although train travel is certainly more interesting. It is getting on for
1000 miles from Paris to Rome.

Alternatively, if you really want to see the Alps and the Italian lakes,
maybe you could find a rail route from Paris to Rome that takes you that
way. It would take some time out of your city stays, of course. If you do
decide to go by rail, for just one journey you'll almost certainly be
better off buying tickets rather than passes.

You can find European railway timetables at http://bahn.de. It has an
English option.

    > 6. Food: Both my wife and I are vegetarians; we hope finding
    > vegetarian food wouldn't be a problem. Milk products are okay.

This shouldn't be a problem in the cities, or in Italy in general; it
might be difficult in the French countryside. You can search this group
for recommendations for vegetarian eating in Paris.

    > 7. Language: We both speak English, do we need to learn native
    > language of the country or can we manage with English?

You'll be fine with only English in large cities, although it's polite -
and usually evokes a positive response - to try speaking a little of the
local language, even if it's only "hello, I don't speak [local language],
do you speak English, thanks, bye".

Markku Grönroos

"Miguel Cruz" <> kirjoitti viestissä
news:pf6dnUVf_J6z-NXcRVn-...
    > What Ever <> wrote:
    > > My wife and I are planning to travel to Europe as tourists from USA
    > > between Nov. 20th and Nov. 28th. I need help in planning the trip.
    > >
    > > 1. Paris: I am assuming one night and two days would be sufficient.
    > I'm not sure you'll get a lot of agreement on that. I don't particularly
    > like Paris and I would say two weeks is the bare minimum.
People have diffrent desires. Two weeks in one city is just eternity in my
opinion.

Dave Smith

What Ever wrote:

    > My wife and I are planning to travel to Europe as tourists from USA
    > between Nov. 20th and Nov. 28th. I need help in planning the trip.
    > Here are the places we are interested in. We are primarily interested
    > in site seeing.
    > 1. Paris: I am assuming one night and two days would be sufficient. We
    > are interested in visiting Eiffel Tower, Louvre, and Seine. I am not
    > sure what else we can see in 2 days.

I would recommend a minimum of four days in Paris. It is a fabulous city
with lots to see and do. The Louvre alone would take you the best part of
a day. It is within walking distance of Notre Dame, musee d'Orsay and les
Invalides.


    > 2. Switzerland: Zurich, and Alps (I am not sure what city we should
    > visit for Alps, and if November would be a good time). We are planning
    > to stay for 1 night and 2 days.
    > 3. Italy: We like to visit Rome, Vatican City, Venice. I am assuming 4
    > days and 4 nights would be sufficient.
    > Here are the things that I need help with. I greatly appreciate your
    > feedback.
    > 1. Travel: Is there a travel agent that you could recommend to get a
    > better trans Atlantic flight rates. We will be leaving from
    > Baltimore/Washington D.C. area and would like to reach Paris, and then
    > probably return from one of the Italian cities.

Any reputable travel agent should be able to help you. Check with your
friends to see who they have used and been happy with. I had good luck
with the local branch of Thomas Cook.


    > 2. Travel from one country to another within Europe (and from one city
    > to another): Is it advisable to purchase rail tickets instead of rail
    > passes? Where can I find information on how long it takes and how much
    > it costs?

About 10 years ago I traveled to Europe with a 15 day Eurail pass. It was
not cheap, but we made the most of it. We wandered around through France,
Germany, and Italy. starting and ending at Paris. We had a great time.
Some people think that you are better off just buying tickets as you go.

    > 3. Itinerary feasibility: Do you think this itinerary is feasible? Or
    > should I make any changes? I have a total of 10 days including
    > trans-Atlantic flying time.

10 day? Your plans sound much too ambitious. You will be spending a lot
of time traveling and not seeing much at all. You might be better off to
stick to France and Germany, Netherlands, Belgium, or to go to Italy and
slip up to Switzerland from there.

    > 4. Places to stay: Do you have any recommendations on where we could
    > stay. We are planning to spend around $100/night.

You might have trouble finding places that cheap in major European
cities. On our Eurail jaunt we always managed to find accommodation
within walking distance of the train stations. If you are looking at that
price range you might want to reconsider Paris and maybe go to Reims which
is about half as expensive.

Tee Doubleyou

On 15 Sep 2004 08:09:45 -0700, (What Ever)
wrote:

    >My wife and I are planning to travel to Europe as tourists from USA
    >between Nov. 20th and Nov. 28th. I need help in planning the trip.
    >Here are the places we are interested in. We are primarily interested
    >in site seeing.
==============cut===========

I hope that this entire post was a joke (kind of funny if so).
Tee

Dominique Foucart

What Ever a écrit :
    > My wife and I are planning to travel to Europe as tourists from USA
    > between Nov. 20th and Nov. 28th. I need help in planning the trip.
    > Here are the places we are interested in. We are primarily interested
    > in site seeing.
    > 1. Paris: I am assuming one night and two days would be sufficient. We
    > are interested in visiting Eiffel Tower, Louvre, and Seine. I am not
    > sure what else we can see in 2 days.
    > 2. Switzerland: Zurich, and Alps (I am not sure what city we should
    > visit for Alps, and if November would be a good time). We are planning
    > to stay for 1 night and 2 days.
    > 3. Italy: We like to visit Rome, Vatican City, Venice. I am assuming 4
    > days and 4 nights would be sufficient.
    > Here are the things that I need help with. I greatly appreciate your
    > feedback.
    > 1. Travel: Is there a travel agent that you could recommend to get a
    > better trans Atlantic flight rates. We will be leaving from
    > Baltimore/Washington D.C. area and would like to reach Paris, and then
    > probably return from one of the Italian cities.
    > 2. Travel from one country to another within Europe (and from one city
    > to another): Is it advisable to purchase rail tickets instead of rail
    > passes? Where can I find information on how long it takes and how much
    > it costs?
    > 3. Itinerary feasibility: Do you think this itinerary is feasible? Or
    > should I make any changes? I have a total of 10 days including
    > trans-Atlantic flying time.
    > 4. Places to stay: Do you have any recommendations on where we could
    > stay. We are planning to spend around $100/night.
    > 5. Recommendations on "places to Visit": We are first time travelers,
    > we believe we like scenic mountains in Switzerland, Lakes in Italy,
    > over-all architectural beauty of Europe, and everything about Paris.
    > Are there any particular recommendations you would like to make?
    > 6. Food: Both my wife and I are vegetarians; we hope finding
    > vegetarian food wouldn't be a problem. Milk products are okay.
    > 7. Language: We both speak English, do we need to learn native
    > language of the country or can we manage with English?
    > Anything else that I am missing?
    > Thanks a lot in advance.
    > SP.

Not surprised by the anwers you are receiving from the group. However,
if you understand that you will see only the "surface" of things, I
would suggest you the following itinirary:

Day 1: USA-Paris : you will arrive in the morning on day 2, which
creates a risk of being seriously tired !
Day 2: spend half a day in the Louvre, half a day with a sight seeing
tour (you will avoid any problem with languages), and potentially a
night cruise on the "bateau mouche" to see the City from the river. It
may be chilly, but it will be magic anyhow.
Day 3: after your first real night, walk through the street of
Montmartre (Sacré-Coeur) and go to the Eiffel tower. Try to grab an
evening flight to Geneva (they are very cheap with easyjet.com, from
Orly. Stay in Geneva for the night.
Day 4: November is the low season for all of the snow/ski/mountain
resorts. However, it may be one of the best time of the year, if it is
sunny. You can take a tour from Geneva to Chamonix and see the Mont
Blanc (the highest point in Europe). If you do not fear altitude, take
the cable car to "l'Aiguille du Midi" you will arrive at + 4000 m and
enjoy a fantastic view of the area. The next day, you should visit
Geneva in the morning and fly to Venice in the afternoon. Stay in
downtown Venice, it's one of the most gratifying experience you will
have to be in a city where no cars are circulating at night.
Day 5: Enjoy a walk through Venice, discover St Marco, the Palacio dei
Dogi and walk around the Rialto Bridge. If you can, stay another night
to fully enjoy your day in the Serenissima.
Day 6: Morning train or flight to Florence. Afternoon visit of the
Uffici museum and night in Florence.
Day 7-9: Flight/train to Rome. You will need day 7, 8 and 9 to have a
first view of the eternal city.
Day 10: Flight back to USA.

Don't take the train for the long trip between Paris and Geneva. You'll
lose 5 hours in TGV and spend twice the price of the plane ticket. Have
everything (except the easyjet flight) booked through a travel agent
(definitely the hotels, to make sure you don't have to look after
them).

Enjoy your first discovery of Europe.

Best Regards,

Dominique from Brussels,

John Bermont

What Ever wrote:
    >
    > 1. Paris: I am assuming one night and two days would be sufficient. We
    > are interested in visiting Eiffel Tower, Louvre, and Seine. I am not
    > sure what else we can see in 2 days.
    >
    > 2. Switzerland: Zurich, and Alps (I am not sure what city we should
    > visit for Alps, and if November would be a good time). We are planning
    > to stay for 1 night and 2 days.
    >
    > 3. Italy: We like to visit Rome, Vatican City, Venice. I am assuming 4
    > days and 4 nights would be sufficient.
    >
For your 8 days select one from the list above. Save the others for
future trips.

John Bermont